Allow crafters to level up

Allow crafters to level up
This idea/suggestion has been flagged as Not Implemented because of a lack of popularity, lack of interest, lack of feasibility, or other determination by the Development Team, so the suggestion will not be implemented. Once a suggestion has been flagged this way, the decision is final. Although the issue may be raised again in the future after a six month cooldown. A response explanation from the Development Team can be found in the thread.
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Melachis

Proposal
Allow all profs to be able to level up to max level via the skill trees, same as the combat profs
Justification
I can't see a down side to allowing all profs to be able to use looted stat clothing and other items currently gated behind combat levels.
The use of higher level weapons not prof specific would help greatly with self preservation as would the level difference between you and the mobs. Having only a simple attack/shoot ability would only make the crafter viable against the lower level mobs of the starter planets so would not have much effect on the current overall gameplay of combat classes but would improve the gameplay of the other classes.
Motivation
Inabilty to use (looted) stat clothing which is level gated to help in their prof, such as creating a luck suit when the player hasn't progressed to the point where they can afford to buy clothing attachments.
Self defense; crafters would at least be mostly safe when placing/tending harvestors on the starter planets once they leveled to the point where the mobs con was gray and would also be able to use better weapons to help with survival on mid level planets
If I remember correctly, in live all profs were able to level up to max lvl through the skill trees same as combat profs.
 
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ByteMe said:
A level 80 crafter isn't going to have the same abilities or capabilities as a level 80 combat toon. A level 80 crafter isn't going to dazzle anyone with their swordsmanship or rifle skills. They'll have none of the combat skill tree attacks or defenses. However, they won't be outright killed by a level 14 mob and they'll be able to put a level 60 droid into play. How about skill level being based on skill tree accomplishment and being referred to as SL instead of CL.
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I'm unclear as to how you think being a master tailor means you'll be able to beat off some alley thug. Like, do you tailor with REALLY HEAVY cloth?
 
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your a crafter not a combat prof you can dual box a combat alt with you or HIRE protection to place harvies i do not see what the big problim is with having glass combat crafters really
 
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As a long time crafter in Live and here, I'll just voice out and say that I actually enjoy being squishy as a crafter and asking for help or bringing my combat character in a dualbox to do what needs to be done out in that dangerous world for a crafter.
 
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For the record, I don't think that they're asking to be combat effective. I think the request is to be able to wear looted statted clothing and be able to have a weapon that you could augment with health or a stat bake in or to be able to use droids. None of which I think are actually problematic. This idea was also floated when the resource bracelet required a higher combat level to equip.

All in all, while I don't think it would be problematic, I don't think it would be dramatically beneficial either. It also may have unintended consequences, so I'm inclined to say the best move is to do nothing and keep it how it is. Personally, I'd like to see the development time used for more impactful changes.
 
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PhilmorALF said:
I can say just by reviewing that actual proposal, that you could let a crafter be a level 80...or you could let them he a level 200...and I don't see what value that would bring to a crafter/entertainer.

They would not get any sort of mitigation for armor hindrence - because that doesn't make sense. They can still wear armor now to get protections, and tape them up to get extra health/defenses.

This essentially come down to people want to use a droid.

For those of you that don't know - the idea was floated by devs to introduce new modifiers into the RE system to allow for exotics that a crafter could use to pull out out droids X levels higher than themselves. I do think this was an interesting and easier way to implement a solution for the crafting community rather than start calculating CLs from non combat professions. I'd certainly hate to be that crafter that is lvl 80 who decides to respec into combat - and now they're pulling high end missions without any real combat skills.

I'm pro 'assisting' crafters in certain scenarios - but no amount of help should be implemented for crafters throwing harvesters on Dath or Endor - as that doesn't make much sense. At some point there is a line that shouldn't be crossed.
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All good points and I agree with you. I just don't think a pure crafter who's at a skill level of 80 is going to be expecting to put harvesters on Dath or Endor. They'll be able to get better armor, call droids, and wear looted clothes.

I'm not for the "xx higher than they are" thought process. We already have that for everyone (+5 levels). Crafters can be very low level, my master crafter is a 3. What defines a 'crafter' for the purposes of pulling a droid, wouldn't that be everyone? A level CL 3 master crafter with all his boxes checked, is the same CL as a newbie pistoleer CL 3. They could both theoretically pull level 8 droids. How would development differentiate between someone doing a lot of crafting, a new person, or someone doing crafting and a combat tree to allow the crafter to pull higher level droid based on their crafting level?

I'd certainly hate to be that crafter that is lvl 80 who decides to respec into combat - and now they're pulling high end missions without any real combat skills. - That's a valid point, but what's the drawback? A crafter surrenders a couple of skills and picks up pistoleer then gets a level 65 mission. I don't think that'll end well for him. If the crafter wanted lower missions, they'd have to surrender all crafting skills to get their skill level back down to a reasonable level. I would need to think this one through.

I definitely believe droids should be capped at 40 for anyone that isn't a Master in a combat class (maybe lower). (i.e. Crafters and such). The object is to let them work on Tatooine and other low / mid level worlds with a chance to survive, not drop harvesters on Dath and Endor.

My final point is that I don't just think it's droids. Certainly it isn't for me, it's also clothes. There are level 80 clothes that are useful for crafting that crafters can't wear (my master crafter is a level 3).

Good points and good discussion, thanks PhilmorALF.
 
PhilmorALF said:
What this tells me is you would like game where you can have a single character that has their hands in every-pot - and not specialize in one thing, but be just as proficient as the characters that do choose a specialization. I'm sorry to tell you - but this isn't that server - and from what I can tell - there are no intentions to make it that way. I'm very much 'pro crafter', and I don't know where you get the impression I'm not part of the 'We', but the game also needs to make sense.

It sounds like you have two thirds of your points spread across base combat professions - which is not effective by any means - as you have found out. You can't expect to be a crafter, an entertainer, have some combat and heals, and also to be a CL80, which unlocks the use of weapons that are set at a level for combat characters that have mastered an advanced profession (CL54). It doesn't make sense.
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I don't care, never did, about being CL80. I want a reasonable degree of survivability, which was easy to get before CLs. Nor was I looking to be "just as proficient as the characters that do choose a specialization". To some people, staying out of end-game content is a feature, not a bug. Cue Frank Sinatra: "I did it my way." I had fun, and didn't impose on anyone. It worked because basic professions were not nerfed into oblivion, because "good low level weapons" were not an oxymoron, and because combat skill points were not the be-all end-all of every life.
 
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juspar said:
What this tells me is that you are new here. You're calling out players that you don't know the history or experience of, and you're pushing ideas based on some memory of a game that does not match what most of us recall. You had 4 of the 5 basic novice boxes on your pre-cu toon? This tells me that you also don't really understand the game at all.

I look forward to hearing more from you once you have played the game a bit and learned about it.
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I understood the game just fine. I did what I enjoyed, with a modest amount of self-sufficiency in simple foods and stims, and was a happy customer of the more proficient when it came to armor, weapons, and fine drink. It really was surprising sometimes, what used to be possible with only a minimal combat template. I soloed the Warren and a couple versions of the Corvette (granted, by sneaking not fighting).
 
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ByteMe said:
All good points and I agree with you. I just don't think a pure crafter who's at a skill level of 80 is going to be expecting to put harvesters on Dath or Endor. They'll be able to get better armor, call droids, and wear looted clothes.

I'm not for the "xx higher than they are" thought process. We already have that for everyone (+5 levels). Crafters can be very low level, my master crafter is a 3. What defines a 'crafter' for the purposes of pulling a droid, wouldn't that be everyone? A level CL 3 master crafter with all his boxes checked, is the same CL as a newbie pistoleer CL 3. They could both theoretically pull level 8 droids. How would development differentiate between someone doing a lot of crafting, a new person, or someone doing crafting and a combat tree to allow the crafter to pull higher level droid based on their crafting level?

I'd certainly hate to be that crafter that is lvl 80 who decides to respec into combat - and now they're pulling high end missions without any real combat skills. - That's a valid point, but what's the drawback? A crafter surrenders a couple of skills and picks up pistoleer then gets a level 65 mission. I don't think that'll end well for him. If the crafter wanted lower missions, they'd have to surrender all crafting skills to get their skill level back down to a reasonable level. I would need to think this one through.

I definitely believe droids should be capped at 40 for anyone that isn't a Master in a combat class (maybe lower). (i.e. Crafters and such). The object is to let them work on Tatooine and other low / mid level worlds with a chance to survive, not drop harvesters on Dath and Endor.

My final point is that I don't just think it's droids. Certainly it isn't for me, it's also clothes. There are level 80 clothes that are useful for crafting that crafters can't wear (my master crafter is a level 3).

Good points and good discussion, thanks PhilmorALF.
Click to expand...
I'm not for the "xx higher than they are" thought process. We already have that for everyone (+5 levels). Crafters can be very low level, my master crafter is a 3. What defines a 'crafter' for the purposes of pulling a droid, wouldn't that be everyone?

Maybe I explained this wrong - but the proposal by Sky I believe was for Exotics that can be used by anyone, obviously, but would most likely benefit low levels the most. Almost like a shirt, chest, and weapon stat that can be made by someone that does RE that would allow someone to add +20 level allowance to pull droids each. With all 3 exotics/stats equipped a, a lvl 1 could in theory pull a lvl 60 droid. You are right - currently that limit is 5. This solution would change that.

I definitely believe droids should be capped at 40 for anyone that isn't a Master in a combat class (maybe lower). (i.e. Crafters and such). The object is to let them work on Tatooine and other low / mid level worlds with a chance to survive, not drop harvesters on Dath and Endor.

For this - I still don't see an issue with a crafter having a level 60 droid. I think it could help on earlier planets, yes, and I don't don't necessarily think crafters should be invincible on high lvl planets, but I think a lvl 60 droid may help but some time to take aggro so they can sprint away and not die. It won't be effective enough to be clearing lairs regardless.

The resource game is random as we all know - so there's no guarantee that a good resource that crafters want will be on a starter planet anyways. We all have to deal with clearing lairs to be able to throw down harvesters. I've helped many crafters blow things up so they can throw down. It's part of a community game in my opinion, where it makes it difficult to be totally self reliant on a single character.

I personally don't think there is any high lvl jewelry that is killing the crafting community for not having. The reason the resource bracelet was changed is because you couldn't get a lvl 65 crafter to use it so it was pointless.
 
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ThriceBurnt said:
I understood the game just fine. I did what I enjoyed, with a modest amount of self-sufficiency in simple foods and stims, and was a happy customer of the more proficient when it came to armor, weapons, and fine drink. It really was surprising sometimes, what used to be possible with only a minimal combat template. I soloed the Warren and a couple versions of the Corvette (granted, by sneaking not fighting).
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Self-sufficiency, to a certain point, is ok. However, it's much lower than other games as per the design philosophy of SWG since the very beginning. People *should* have to rely on others. In fact, there are things in this game that is soloable that we are moving to ask that they NOT be soloable, such as the Ace Pilot mission and other content that was intended to be group content.
 
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I’m going to close this one out as we don’t intend on making any changes here. Combat level is exactly that, a combat level. It doesn’t, nor should it, apply to non-combat professions.

Professions without a combat level can still obtain buffs, stims, and use droids for protection, or venture into more dangerous areas with a group of other players for protection, which is an intended mechanic in how the game world was designed.
 
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