Jedi Visibility/Life Rework

Jedi Visibility/Life Rework
This idea/suggestion has been flagged as Implemented so it has (or will be) implemented into the game in some capacity. More information can be found in the post from the development team.
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colt45

Galactic Senator
Proposal
Changes to the visibility and life system to add appropriate consequences for playing the alpha class of Jedi.

- Remove Vader
+ Higher Vis levels activate a jedi TEF (Anyone can choose to attack the jedi)
+ 1 life, you die, time to play one of your 3 other characters for a bit. (Maybe reduce the force ghost time to compensate)
+ Time limit for how long can be spent in safe haven per day.
- Remove or nerf vis reduction bonus in the safe haven.
+ Add mechanics for Jedi to do in the open world to reduce their visibility.
Justification
While Vader is a cool idea, he merely just becomes an annoyance that needs to be fled from so the Jedi can afk meditate at the safe haven. A better high vis level mechanic would be a Jedi TEF where anyone could choose to start attacking the jedi.

Safe haven meditating is just sitting afk, and the fast travel to it makes it even worse. Not only is it bad gameplay, but it goes against the lore and in game idea that jedi are rare and being hunted.

And vis reduction mechanics are fine, but should be done in the open world where the jedi actually have some risk. A quick example I came up with in 2 minutes, is the hidden altar POI's having rotating timers for giving enhanced vis reduction for meditating.

And I think having 1 life before going ghost is important for group PvP, if that ever gets serious again of course. If you kill a jedi or lose a jedi on your side, it should feel impactful, and that player should have to play a normal toon.
Motivation
The current system we have has a very safe and AFK favorable meta for Jedi gameplay.
I think these proposed changes would bring appropriate risk and more engaging content to both the Jedi and other players.
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People want jedi to be under constant threat, less brazen, and seen in less numbers. Theres like 20 frustrated pvp bhs just waiting for the 10 mins/24 hours that jedi leave the ranch.

Seems like the solution to everyone's complaints would just be forcing jedi back into the world.

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Kazhar said:
Removing vis based bounties absolutely destroys the whole purpose of jedi bhing and effectively makes certain jedi immune to bhs because only a handful of them will pvp and even a lesser number of them will get DBs and a pvp bounty. Killing a bh should not remove you from the terminal either because you can easily kill a shitter and automatically you are getting content away from other more skilled bhs that didnt have their opportunity to take and attack that bounty target. The smuggler thing would be okay if it wasnt abusable and had a quite long CD
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No it doesn't you missed the part where Vader now sets a bounty on a Jedi that escapes him regardless of their vis you would be able to hunt them. It is effectively this way now this is moving the player consequence to after they normally have escaped
 
JaxRiens said:
No it doesn't you missed the part where Vader now sets a bounty on a Jedi that escapes him regardless of their vis you would be able to hunt them. It is effectively this way now this is moving the player consequence to after they normally have
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Most people will afk in the ranch in the very moment inquisitors start coming after them, way before vader appears, so your hypothetical scenario would indeed make jedi bounties scarce af. Not to mention most people commenting here agrees that vader should somewhat be delayed or like the very last resort. Also your suggestion would make the vis system consequenceless until you reach the last vis threshold
 
Kazhar said:
Most people will afk in the ranch in the very moment inquisitors start coming after them, way before vader appears, so your hypothetical scenario would indeed make jedi bounties scarce af. Not to mention most people commenting here agrees that vader should somewhat be delayed or like the very last resort. Also your suggestion would make the vis system consequenceless until you reach the last vis threshold
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Could move it where inquisitors can do that as well. The point being making the current vis tier system be pve consequences. with PVP consequences coming if you escape the pve ones.
 
JaxRiens said:
Could move it where inquisitors can do that as well. The point being making the current vis tier system be pve consequences. with PVP consequences coming if you escape the pve ones.
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Yea the thing is moving the "pvp consequences" to after the pve ones makes it even easier than it currently is to avoid pvp on your jedi and that sucks imo. Jedi bhing is and endless endgame loop that keeps the game alive
 
Kazhar said:
Yea the thing is moving the "pvp consequences" to after the pve ones makes it even easier than it currently is to avoid pvp on your jedi and that sucks imo. Jedi bhing is and endless endgame loop that keeps the game alive
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So the current bh consequence doesn't come until after the one you mentioned being the trigger point.... My solution is to make them parallel chains. Player BHs were always after pve consequences. Even in the old system you could avoid vis to full template.
 
Fezix93 said:
1. Leave Vader as the ultimate anti-jedi, but improve him so that he can't so easily be escaped from. Perhaps he spawns with other inquisition/troopers/etc that instabreak/snare vehicles and/or paralyze/daze the target Jedi so that Vader can approach and destroy the Jedi without the Jedi so easily kiting him or escaping. Perhaps a TIE Bomber does a flyby first and incaps/weakens the Jedi first. Something along those lines. There needs to be something where becoming too brazen/visible pretty much guarentees the Jedi's death, and this system needs to be able to target and eliminate the Jedi (almost) anywhere regardless of available players/bounty hunters. This should be in addition to either perma-TEF or increased player bounty hunters after a certain threshold. In short, if your vis gets high enough to summon Vader, it should be an almost guarenteed death for the Jedi.

2. Keep number of available lives as is to account for the game crashing/being dumb at the worst times and also to give some leeway for non-minmaxed players, but change the ghost timer from real hours to account-hours played. This would make it so that the player must either play as a ghost or on their other characters before they are able to respawn as a Jedi again, as well as limit AFKing the timer since the timer is based on account time instead of being able to alt-tab between characters. Somehow I get the feeling people will be less likely to do obvious things with their Jedi if the penalty for running out of lives is 24 account-playhours before their Jedi can respawn.

The other suggestions are fine, including making it harder to insta-travel to a safe haven from almost anywhere as well as giving Jedi more non-afk avenues to reduce their Visibility.
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I agree.

Jedi force ghost period should be counted as hours logged in, not hours overall. People need to be incentivized to not abandon their non-jedi characters and just tunnel-vision their Jedi. Bringing out your Jedi should be treated as a big deal and kind of a gamble. Jedi should always be very powerful, but at the cost of them not always being available to play. If you lose your Jedi, go spend time playing your other characters and you'll get him back.

On the other hand, this whole bitching and complaining about it being too easy to go to the Ranch is quite silly. If going to the Ranch is the only way to learn Jedi boxes (because for some reason Jedi can't train each other???) then it better be easy and not a pain. Besides, doesn't 'The Path' not work if you have high VIS?
 
Many of these changes have been implemented, and we will continue to improve and rebalance the Visibility system to ensure the risk/reward is fair, but try to keep the game fun too.

- Vader no longer spawns until you have killed an Inquisitor
- PvP deaths now immediately Ghost a Jedi
- Safe Havens are no longer the most effective way of reducing visibility
- Additional open world methods were added for reducing visibility
- Bounty Hunters are being given more tools for culling Jedi, and quality of life improvements for hunting Jedi specifically.
- Jedi XP loss is being added, with an extra penalty for a visibility-related death.
- Visibility gain and loss are being adjusted to both be manageable (especially in PvP situations), but appropriately difficult to work off.
 
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